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Just ordered the ZL1 cradle bushings, will any of the 2016 + Camaro BMR differential bushing kits work for our setup?
Wandering or Unstable feeling during WOT at high speeds.
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Ok guys, I think have some info that may rule out some root causes for this swaying issue. It's been suggested it could be the "over-aggressive" programming in the ELSD, bad alignment, suspension flex, shocks, springs, tires, sidewalls...you name it. Piece by piece, I've worked my way through most of these. (minus the shocks & the ELSD "programmer" available for the 'Vettes-which I no longer think I'll need).
Keep in mind that while I am lowered on WX springs, the swaying condition started when I was TOTALLY STOCK for the first 8kmi. That being said, the sway condition was greatly exacerbated once lowered, which introduces another variable. Just remember that in the sequence below, all corrective measures for the sway were attempted AFTER being lowered.
So, after 5kmi running the car totally stock, it was scary at 3/4 WOT. I thought it was just old rubber, and took the opportunity to install the WX spring set prior to getting all new tires and an alignment. The non-performance shop was barely able to align all 4 corners in the green, and the rear camber was barely in the red. Now, after just 2k-3k miles on my first set of new rear tires, the sway was back, but WAY worse-I mean this bitch was squirrely at even 2/3 WOT, and eating up the inside shoulder of the rears. Realigned and installed new rears...same thing.
Fed up, in the effort to be able to align the suspension properly ("center green") when already dumped an inch through the stroke, I needed adjustable front cam bolts to allow more negative camber, and I installed the Carlyle Drag suspension, sans the calipers, which allowed all of the stabilizer arm lengths to be adjusted. During the drives post a TRUE PERFORMANCE SHOP alignment (<-that's key!), these fixes planted the ass-end 100% at WOT, but to say it was more stable because of the Carlyle arms or the now-corrected rear geometry, I don't know. What I CAN say is that, once the upgrade was completed, WOT was like being shot straight out of a cannon, and there was no mileage "limit" on WOT stability as before; all 7kmi on those tires were as good as the first! IF YOU'RE LOWERED AND SQUIRRELY, YOU MUST INSTALL THIS KIT. If you're lowered w/o this kit and NOT squirrely, A) you're not driving hard enough, B) you're prematurely wearing your tires, and C) you're enjoying reduced performance. That being said, even if I wasn't lowered, I'd STILL recommend the Carlyle Kit. There's just no way that the shitty OEM, stamped-steel stabilizer arms are not flexing under power, especially if you're modded. They're flimsy GARBAGE, and I suspect that they're the overall reason for everyones' sway issue.
You're asking yourself, why'd he only get 7kmi out of that last alignment & set of tires? About two weeks ago, I needed to get new wheels and rubber due to the dual-right side blowouts experienced on my 20in. set from a jagged pothole. I had to go back to the stock wheels and tires because the replacement set of wheels and tires I ordered is, unsurprisingly, on backorder (going back to 19's). Obviously, the higher sidewalls and age of the rubber made the car less capable, but she still shot STRAIGHT. Remember, that's 7k miles since the proper alignment, and on old rubber.
Since my lift isn't in yet, I had the performance shop realign it, re-shoe the stock wheels, and install the rear solid aluminum Z28 bushings I was going to do myself. The only reason I even had the bushings was because I bought them as backup in case the earlier remedy failed, which it didn't. But hell, they can't hurt, right? Well, in my estimation, post bushing swap, the car is no more or less "stable" at WOT than it was prior. Could there be the benefit of increased stability at WOT on older, higher mileage rubber? Maybe, only time will tell, but from the feeling in your ass at WOT out of the gate, it's the same.
So, to recap, I'm on the stock shocks, stock "unprogrammed" ELSD, back to the stock sidewall tire on the stock wheel...I can, in my experience, rule all of those out as root causes. The only thing I can readily point to that SOLVED my issue was the Carlyle Kit, and a TRUE performance alignment. The jury is still out on the bushings, but as far as increase in WOT stability outta the box, that's a no.
Keep in mind that while I am lowered on WX springs, the swaying condition started when I was TOTALLY STOCK for the first 8kmi. That being said, the sway condition was greatly exacerbated once lowered, which introduces another variable. Just remember that in the sequence below, all corrective measures for the sway were attempted AFTER being lowered.
So, after 5kmi running the car totally stock, it was scary at 3/4 WOT. I thought it was just old rubber, and took the opportunity to install the WX spring set prior to getting all new tires and an alignment. The non-performance shop was barely able to align all 4 corners in the green, and the rear camber was barely in the red. Now, after just 2k-3k miles on my first set of new rear tires, the sway was back, but WAY worse-I mean this bitch was squirrely at even 2/3 WOT, and eating up the inside shoulder of the rears. Realigned and installed new rears...same thing.
Fed up, in the effort to be able to align the suspension properly ("center green") when already dumped an inch through the stroke, I needed adjustable front cam bolts to allow more negative camber, and I installed the Carlyle Drag suspension, sans the calipers, which allowed all of the stabilizer arm lengths to be adjusted. During the drives post a TRUE PERFORMANCE SHOP alignment (<-that's key!), these fixes planted the ass-end 100% at WOT, but to say it was more stable because of the Carlyle arms or the now-corrected rear geometry, I don't know. What I CAN say is that, once the upgrade was completed, WOT was like being shot straight out of a cannon, and there was no mileage "limit" on WOT stability as before; all 7kmi on those tires were as good as the first! IF YOU'RE LOWERED AND SQUIRRELY, YOU MUST INSTALL THIS KIT. If you're lowered w/o this kit and NOT squirrely, A) you're not driving hard enough, B) you're prematurely wearing your tires, and C) you're enjoying reduced performance. That being said, even if I wasn't lowered, I'd STILL recommend the Carlyle Kit. There's just no way that the shitty OEM, stamped-steel stabilizer arms are not flexing under power, especially if you're modded. They're flimsy GARBAGE, and I suspect that they're the overall reason for everyones' sway issue.
You're asking yourself, why'd he only get 7kmi out of that last alignment & set of tires? About two weeks ago, I needed to get new wheels and rubber due to the dual-right side blowouts experienced on my 20in. set from a jagged pothole. I had to go back to the stock wheels and tires because the replacement set of wheels and tires I ordered is, unsurprisingly, on backorder (going back to 19's). Obviously, the higher sidewalls and age of the rubber made the car less capable, but she still shot STRAIGHT. Remember, that's 7k miles since the proper alignment, and on old rubber.
Since my lift isn't in yet, I had the performance shop realign it, re-shoe the stock wheels, and install the rear solid aluminum Z28 bushings I was going to do myself. The only reason I even had the bushings was because I bought them as backup in case the earlier remedy failed, which it didn't. But hell, they can't hurt, right? Well, in my estimation, post bushing swap, the car is no more or less "stable" at WOT than it was prior. Could there be the benefit of increased stability at WOT on older, higher mileage rubber? Maybe, only time will tell, but from the feeling in your ass at WOT out of the gate, it's the same.
So, to recap, I'm on the stock shocks, stock "unprogrammed" ELSD, back to the stock sidewall tire on the stock wheel...I can, in my experience, rule all of those out as root causes. The only thing I can readily point to that SOLVED my issue was the Carlyle Kit, and a TRUE performance alignment. The jury is still out on the bushings, but as far as increase in WOT stability outta the box, that's a no.
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They help with everything.
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373 Posts
The factory traction control is quite amazing in the wet. If you do flip the mode to wet/snow, on a wet down skid pad and nailing the throttle in a figure 8, I was amazed at how the computer kicks in and helps the recovery. It first allows a little movement and waits to see if you have it and then just about immediately pulls timing and controls the slip and gets the car back in shape.
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think they're bad in moderate+ rain? Try running Toyo R888R... They're great on a damp road after a rain, but during?...It's like driving on friggin' teflon. Dry though, or damp?...You could drive up the wall of the Grand Canyon.
The arms alone fixed me. Didn't need the solid rear cradle bushings, but had them already, so I did them too. I think the bushings just isolate vibration, and therefore dampen road feel. No way the stock bushing would allow the cradle to skew under the car, unless worn out.
So it sounds like you recommend against doing the bushings, as this takes away from how it feels driving the car.
My 17 V is currently at BMR for some R&D. They called my buddy(Ben) but he sold his red V. so he gave them my number. I said sure. I don't have all the details but they are looking to get some better install instructions and confirming exactly what will fit from the Camaro platform and I my get some installed components out of the deal 
I will say I had the bad wandering as well but then when my car was being modded the shop noticed both my rear struts were leaking so they finished the mods and I went to the dealer for the strut replacement under warr. Since they were both replaced the wandering did not seem as bad. Car runs decent. (10.4's)
Will keep you all posted on what they say etc...What fits etc..
They bought all the Carlyle component's so they also trying to compare them both.
I will say I had the bad wandering as well but then when my car was being modded the shop noticed both my rear struts were leaking so they finished the mods and I went to the dealer for the strut replacement under warr. Since they were both replaced the wandering did not seem as bad. Car runs decent. (10.4's)
Will keep you all posted on what they say etc...What fits etc..
They bought all the Carlyle component's so they also trying to compare them both.
I was wandering that as well.
The contemplative V.
So I am getting to this late so apologies if this was already answered before. I am also experiencing scary traction sway at WOT... is the fix this kit :
RSK639 - Rear Suspension Kit For 15" Conversion Kit
Free Shipping on all BMR Suspension packages!
How hard is the installation?
RSK639 - Rear Suspension Kit For 15" Conversion Kit
Free Shipping on all BMR Suspension packages!
How hard is the installation?
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