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Discussion Starter #1
Up to the rectangular pump hole? Half covering the hole? Extra oil cooling? Problems...?
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Sure is quite up in here...

Has anyone heard of someone running a filled LSA block on the street?
 

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No one streets filled blocks, might be able to get away with a half fill I suppose. Whats the projected power that warrants filling it? Sleeve it or get an iron block.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Enough to warrant more structural integrity. But, not enough to warrant an SHP block...I hope. Who is sleeving these blocks worth the money?

I know someone streeting a N/A-NOS LS block that is filled to 1" below the top of the water jacket. I've heard tell of someone up to 3/4". That could just be urban legend over on yellow bullet... I was just curious if someone has tried it, or know of someone who has.
 

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I cannot vouch for an LS block, but I have seen a filled "iron" small block chevy that was ran quite frequently on the street to include some lengthy jaunts on the interstate. He actually did a hurricane evac in the car and drove 3 hours away!! Anyhow, it was a 400 SBC that was filled to the bottom of the water pump holes. He beat the hell out of it and finally broke the crank in half on a nitrous hit, it had the stock iron crank. We tore the engine down at my shop, so I saw the carnage first hand. It had eagle rods and the rods got so hot they turned blue. To my surprise, the bearings looked decent as did the pistons and rings. IMO, the reason the engine didn't seize from the heat was the synthetic oil he used, Mobile 1 IIRC. If it was a full mineral based oil the engine would have locked up long before the crank snapped. He put in another rotating assembly and added an oil cooler to watch oil temps. We lost touch with each other shortly after the rebuild, so I can't speak for the oil cooler upgrade, but that was a definite must have for a filled block. All in all, I was pretty impressed with the condition of the engine on tear down and I witnessed 1st had the amount of driving/abuse he put on the car. I think if you can keep the oil temps in check, a filled block can work on the street.
 

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Isn’t ERL out of business, or did they fire back up?
 

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Not sure, was back when I was debating a turbo setup when I talked to them and RHS, to be honest RHS was much better to speak with and had a better rep at the time.
 

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I cannot vouch for an LS block, but I have seen a filled "iron" small block chevy that was ran quite frequently on the street to include some lengthy jaunts on the interstate. He actually did a hurricane evac in the car and drove 3 hours away!! Anyhow, it was a 400 SBC that was filled to the bottom of the water pump holes. He beat the hell out of it and finally broke the crank in half on a nitrous hit, it had the stock iron crank. We tore the engine down at my shop, so I saw the carnage first hand. It had eagle rods and the rods got so hot they turned blue. To my surprise, the bearings looked decent as did the pistons and rings. IMO, the reason the engine didn't seize from the heat was the synthetic oil he used, Mobile 1 IIRC. If it was a full mineral based oil the engine would have locked up long before the crank snapped. He put in another rotating assembly and added an oil cooler to watch oil temps. We lost touch with each other shortly after the rebuild, so I can't speak for the oil cooler upgrade, but that was a definite must have for a filled block. All in all, I was pretty impressed with the condition of the engine on tear down and I witnessed 1st had the amount of driving/abuse he put on the car. I think if you can keep the oil temps in check, a filled block can work on the street.
Boostjunky Wrote:
"He beat the hell out of it and finally broke the crank in half on a nitrous hit, it had the stock iron crank."

That really made me laugh; uses Nitrous, fills the block to the bottom
of the water pump holes, and uses a stock 'Iron Crank'. .LOL

Boostjunky also wrote:
"He put in another rotating assembly and added an oil cooler to watch oil temps.
A little late, but still a very good idea. . .

When did he decide to put in an engine water temp gauge. . .Just being sarcastic!

RD
 
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Boostjunky Wrote:
"He beat the hell out of it and finally broke the crank in half on a nitrous hit, it had the stock iron crank."

That really made me laugh; uses Nitrous, fills the block to the bottom
of the water pump holes, and uses a stock 'Iron Crank'. .LOL

Boostjunky also wrote:
"He put in another rotating assembly and added an oil cooler to watch oil temps.
A little late, but still a very good idea. . .

When did he decide to put in an engine water temp gauge. . .Just being sarcastic!

RD
Bruce, glad to see you commenting.

I really don't "get" why they do this. Is it just to strengthen the cylinders? Doesn't mean that the heat will end up killing the cylinders they are trying to save?
 

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It strengthens the sleeves, more or less keeps them from distorting or becoming out of round under pressure.
So wouldn't filling up the water passages, to strengthen, causes more heat to be retained in the block which causes metal to fail?
 

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You don't actually block all of the coolant passages but yes that's why the op is asking about streeting a filled block, and asking about oil cooling. Obviously oil takes much longer to heat up than coolant so on a dedicated drag car the heat isn't as much of an issue.

Sorry to double post, but I wanted to add that it's more of a cheap workaround to getting sleeves, I would imagine it's more of a junkyard 5.3 or 6.0 practice, when you ruin one you go spend another 500 bucks and a few bags of ardex lol
 

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Good read, Cummins guys call the o ring head gasket "fire ring". If anyone knows about cylinder pressure it's the diesel guys lol.
 

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Bruce, glad to see you commenting.

I really don't "get" why they do this. Is it just to strengthen the cylinders? Doesn't mean that the heat will end up killing the cylinders they are trying to save?
Blades, yes as others have stated above, it helps to strengthen a block too weak for the HP.

Other than dollars, there is no reason to do this today, as we have blocks that are extremely
adequate for the power levels of today.

This was not true back in the 1970's when we only had factory parts to work with.

On small block Chevrolet's, once we began to make ~550 fwHP, the blocks would
be pushed out on the major thrust side of the engine.

So we began to fill the blocks (Drag Cars Only) to strengthen them.

We also modified the cooling systems and restricted the oil so that
each valve cover was not holding a quart of oil at the end of the 1/4 mile,
in an attempt to keep the oil in the pan where it belonged (wet sump).

Today, if your running Alcohol, you can purchase CNC blocks that have
no block cooling, or add some. . . As many cooling passages as you want.

The article quoted by Adam 112 is a very good article
,
but again. . .

Purchase a block of sufficient strength for your 'Street / Strip'
car as far as I am concerned. . . .

Consider the build that we are speaking about. . .

Filled the block to save dollars
Used a stock cast crank to save dollars.
Uses Nitrous, a cheap way to achieve more HP.

Cheers,
Bruce
 
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Blades, yes as others have stated above, it helps to strengthen a block too weak for the HP.

Other than dollars, there is no reason to do this today, as we have blocks that are extremely
adequate for the power levels of today.

This was not true back in the 1970's when we only had factory parts to work with.

On small block Chevrolet's, once we began to make ~550 fwHP, the blocks would
be pushed out on the major thrust side of the engine.

So we began to fill the blocks (Drag Cars Only) to strengthen them.

We also modified the cooling systems and restricted the oil so that
each valve cover was not holding a quart of oil at the end of the 1/4 mile,
in an attempt to keep the oil in the pan where it belonged (wet sump).

Today, if your running Alcohol, you can purchase CNC blocks that have
no block cooling, or add some. . . As many cooling passages as you want.

The article quoted by Adam 112 is a very good article
,
but again. . .

Purchase a block of sufficient strength for your 'Street / Strip'
car as far as I am concerned. . . .

Consider the build that we are speaking about. . .

Filled the block to save dollars
Used a stock cast crank to save dollars.
Uses Nitrous, a cheap way to achieve more HP.

Cheers,
Bruce
That is a great history of why also why it does not make sense for today.
 
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That is a great history of why also why it does not make sense for today.
There is a lot of History to preparing and IC Engine for 'Performance Usage'.
But as with much History, it gets lost or misinterpreted as time moves on. . . .

Much of this country's History was rewritten so to speak after the Civil War.

Many of the people that helped write the Declaration of Independence and
the Constitution came from Ireland and Scotland. History books kind of
indicate that a group of 'British' just floated a few boats, arrived at our
shores and decided to not use the 'Top Down' form of Government they
left behind them.

Remember; the Romans could not conquer the Scottish!

They 'Actually' came here to 'Establish' a Government, whereby unlike England
and Rome 2000 years ago, that the Government should not be run from the
'Top Down', that it should be run by the people from the 'Ground Up' so
to speak, which allows the people to elect legislators to act on their behalf.

Much of the very important History of the people who framed our Constitution,
was completely lost after the Civil War. . . .

Cheers,
Bruce
 

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Discussion Starter #19
ERL has been gone almost 4 years now.

I cannot vouch for an LS block, but I have seen a filled "iron" small block chevy...
Not quite what I'm looking for, but thank you for the post 😁

That really made me laugh; uses Nitrous, fills the block to the bottom of the water pump holes, and uses a stock 'Iron Crank'. .LOL
After reading that, I thought I could hear Jeff Foxworthy saying, "then you might be a redneck"!

My goal is 920 whp with a factory converter ZL1. A modified LSA will get me there, but the block will be the weak link after the rods and pistons. I just hate to buy all the studs, do all the machine work, etc...and have the block fail. The LSA block is all but oil cooled as it is. With all that oil spraying around, all that windage, an easily modified factory oil cooling system... If I buy a Dart SHP Pro block, why not go 427-440? Buy some better 6 bolt heads. Shot for 1800fwhp... No good place to stop.
 

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Well gang, I threw that out there to share my experience. This was a fairly long time ago and we were young Airman in the USAF trying to haul ass on the cheap. He was pretty successful with it considering what he had. As RD mentioned, with the availability of aftermarket blocks there really is no need to do it. But if you're stretched for bucks I guess this could be an alternative.
 
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