[BossMasato]

It is 2022 now. I own a 2013 Cadillac CTS 3.6L Premium. I read some old posts back from 2012-2013, about swapping an LS9 from peoples existing LSA. Today, more and better advancements have been proven. I was going to ask the community about changing from the LFX to an LS9 if it was an easy-fit surgery? I know I will be doing a marriage swap. Some may ask why go through that instead of buying a V for close gains? Well, The Premium White Diamond Tricoat with the Cashmere interior with the Rosewood ( I think it is), trim is why. I paid only $15,000 for mine a year ago. Now after another year maybe 2 years from now, paying the bank to claim ownership, I plan to do this swap. An LSA will be cheaper yet, not as reliable from videos and reading a bit, that well compared to an existing LS9. If I do choose to do so, beef it up toward the new golden mark a lot dream to reach; the 1,000 WHP, I will need reliable tried and true hardware. I do ask the question has someone(s) completed the task or had the task done for them, yet? If so what did you add, which Cam profile, any added headers, or went with stock? Did you try a Kong 6550 Blower with the 1.9L or 2.3L Intake? What other boosts were added if any? Since I have the Stock Calipers for the 3.6L running 18" Rims with 245/45/18 profile tires, do I or should I go to the Brembo Style Calipers? I do have Carbon Ceramic Pads installed. Which Transmission and Converter plate did you use? Do you think the stock 373 Rear Differential will hold up? I heard of going Titanium Driveshaft. Oh, and Engine mounts, what brand, and style? Thanx for your support and help in my quest for an excellent power plant setup.

 

[Karch]

Tell me you’re trolling.


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[BossMasato]

Tell me you’re trolling.


No, I am beyond acting as some child! Why do you think I am doing so?

 

[Karch]

Because what you are attempting to do, starting with a 3.6L version, makes little sense.

You’re better off buying a V and swapping your interior parts into it.

As you will find by reading through this forum, the rearend is fairly stout, though some do groan.


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[BossMasato]

Yes, some think to buy one instead. Yet, not one V, shares the interior scheme. Only a Black Diamond is to compare. I am not into dark colors. White and Gold looks better than Blackout everything. If one knows what colors actually mean and represent. I do enjoy being the oddball who is different from the carbon copies. I am asking for solid advice here. I am guessing it will be fine with my plan. I am interested in some actual technical mechanical advice beforehand preceding my adventure, thanx!

 

[piening2150]

Karch just gave you some solid advice. Find a White Diamond CTS-V and swap a regular CTS cashmere interior into it if that is really important to you. It will be much easier and far less costly in the long run than trying to buy and properly integrate all the mechanical bits into your current car. Seriously.

 

[Slizzo]

Karch just gave you some solid advice. Find a White Diamond CTS-V and swap a regular CTS cashmere interior into it if that is really important to you. It will be much easier and far less costly in the long run than trying to buy and properly integrate all the mechanical bits into your current car. Seriously.

And, it's not just the mechanical bits that differentiate the two. There's a lot of suspension components there too, plus brakes, etc...

Answer is always the same for people wanting to swap larger motors into their cars that were already offered with a larger motor; just buy the car that came with the larger motor first. Always cheaper in the long run that way (in time, cost, and sanity).

 

[BossMasato]

I did find one from Edmonds right now, exterior paint match yes. The entire interior will need to be swapped; dash, floor, rear partial shelf, doors ect. I could pay, $45,000 plus interest and taxes, then what ever mods plus the interior. That will be more than the approximate $25,000 with installation for what I want. The trade in Value could be $13,000 from my current auto or $16,000 private. Current market in the next 8 years does not look bright. I already done the math. Doing my own vision will be cheaper and worth it! Hood, Dash Cluster, maybe Calipers change will be the only additional mods. The wood grain steering wheel is staying. It will make an excellent You Tube Video.

 

[random84]

Good luck - I can't fault you for being motivated, but as others have said there's a LOT of work that goes into trying to upgrade a base into a V.

There have been several who asked the question over the years, the only one I can recall being even close to done was a hack job with fire damage by a con artist - I don't recall what happened to him or the car, but I don't think he sold it anywhere reputably. Even if your car is mechanically sound, it will be a huge red flag on resale - as there are very few people willing to pay blue book for someone's frankenbuild. But hey, if you're cool with that than go for it!

The problem with an engine swap, is that I'm pretty sure the subframe is different. The suspension parts might be reusable, but you'd have to start scouring the GM part suppliers to check part numbers and fitment. The subframe is $600-1000 alone, plus another grand for most of the front suspension. Steering knuckles different? Well, then you get to buy brakes, calipers and lines too. Don't forget the wheels!

And don't forget the transmission either ($3k), cooler lines (?), driveshaft ($500?), sourcing the Transmission mount and odds and ends ($100+) plus the engine harness for your motor ($500 if you can find one?); and then all the accessories, hoses and connections that often are NOT included: alternator, P/S pump & reservoir, pullies, idlers, A/C. Only the oil cooler is something that's easily replaced with after market parts. All those bits will add up... conservatively I'd guess it will be $3-6k right there depending on new vs used, shipping, and sourcing of components.

So now you're looking at $8-10k+ for just the Transmission, accessories, brackets and odds and ends for the front end - not counting the motor itself. And now repeat the same issues for the rear - I don't think the subframe will accept a V diff, so if you tried to change that it's another subframe, plus the $2500 differential itself, plus half-axles, harnesses, probably the E-brake and then God-knows-what on suspension parts. If the suspension pieces are all different, then you're replacing the rear hub as well.

Realistically, given how hard some of these parts will be to find and ship, plus you're time and stress, I'd estimate you're looking at closer to $30k for anything with a motor that would be worth doing this for.

Oh, and we haven't gotten into body panels or paint yet; and did we talk about ECM's and body control modules? There are 20+ computers buried in the V, and most of them talk to one another via the CANBUS. You'll have a nightmare of a time turning off all the engine error codes, so consider a stand alone engine management system ($5k) to avoid that and improve ease of tuning.

It would be an epic build, but at the end of the day you'd have a base model hacked into something sort of resembling a V, that you'd get hosed on short of parting it back out for wholesale used prices, plus the time cost of your efforts physically sourcing and building the car that will still ultimately not be as good as a V. Best case scenario you're $20,000 into a base-model CTS with a sleeper motor.

It really does make sense to buy a different car. If you decide to go through with it, start a build thread here.

 

[MeanMike]

The LS9 is a dry sump motor so you'll have to fit the big dry sump tank somewhere (maybe in the trunk) and with accessories and computer it's close to $25k. I'm pretty sure the accessories are no longer available anyway.

You should totally do this, start a build thread. PM me when you decide to scrap the whole project and are selling the new parts at half price.

 

[SofaKingSlow]

I was going to ask the community about changing from the LFX to an LS9 if it was an easy-fit surgery?

No. No it is not. It is not "an easy-fit surgery." It can be done, but should only be attempted as an expression of self-hatred with a side of futility.

Some may ask why go through that instead of buying a V for close gains? Well, The Premium White Diamond Tricoat with the Cashmere interior with the Rosewood ( I think it is), trim is why. I paid only $15,000 for mine a year ago. Now after another year maybe 2 years from now, paying the bank to claim ownership, I plan to do this swap. An LSA will be cheaper yet, not as reliable from videos and reading a bit, that well compared to an existing LS9. If I do choose to do so, beef it up toward the new golden mark a lot dream to reach; the 1,000 WHP, I will need reliable tried and true hardware.

We collectively are attempting to prevent our younger nephew from wasting time, money and frustration on a project that has been completed many times over much more simply than the process you are describing. We are trading you our ax for your wooden kitchen spoon as you're heading out to clear a forest.

If you must do this, either find one in your exterior color to swap interiors, or find a wreck at a salvage auction, because you will need all those parts and more.

 

[Blades1_99]

has been completed many times over much more simply

Has a swap, as Random pointed out above been done? I recall the V wagon that wasn't, but not many others.

I recall a lot of people talking about it, especially on Farcebook.

 

[RobF300]

wood grain steering wheel is staying It will make an excellent You Tube Video.

why didnt you start out with this! Now I'm sold on the idea!

I think you misjudge the time and cost to do this, and you owe money on the car so begs to question where are you coming up with the $25k or so to build it up?
do you have another car to drive in the meantime?
a 1000hp daily driver certainly is doable but you need something as a back up, 1000hp cars break and need SOMETHING all the time.

 

[MrSurly]

Besides the proposal to “V-swap” a CTS, which is a fool’s errand if ever such has existed, we haven’t beGUN to consider Part Deux of the OP’s stated mission, to wit:
A 1000HP build!
I can certainly attest that it will cost a LOT more than he has suggested, I have the spreadsheet. Also , I started with a V!

 

[BossMasato]

2013 3.6L Subframe, I am not sure about that. The Rear Differential is the same as with the V, 373 Final Drive. FE2 style Struts/ Shocks installed, Sport Shock Absorbers (AC Delco FE2). I had them replaced during the winter of 2021-2022. It is a Premium Collection Submodel above Performance 2nd in line of the list with the V at the top. On the Brakes Calipers, I can get a set of new OEM, all 4 for the Camaro, at AutoZone for around $400 and put them on myself, Brakes are easy! On the actual Swap, it will be $4,000-$5400 for the marriage swap to get installed in my region. I plan on buying GM direct when I do. Only $21,000 from them. If I go, aftermarket Vender may be slightly cheaper or may be more expensive. Seems like no one actually thought things though as I have so far, or knows how to conserve currency for a larger picture. I still have 2 years of planning I am giving myself.

 

[BossMasato]

Tunning, I got that already covered. Monte GTR, own one currently.

 

[Karch]

You think the v6 diff is the same as the supercharged v8 diff?

The SS calipers are not the same, just so you know. The Camaro SS is also not 4300#, but it’s your car, I’m sure it will be a fun project.


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[MrSurly]

2013 3.6L Subframe, I am not sure about that. The Rear Differential is the same as with the V, 373 Final Drive. FE2 style Struts/ Shocks installed, Sport Shock Absorbers (AC Delco FE2). I had them replaced during the winter of 2021-2022. It is a Premium Collection Submodel above Performance 2nd in line of the list with the V at the top. On the Brakes Calipers, I can get a set of new OEM, all 4 for the Camaro, at AutoZone for around $400 and put them on myself, Brakes are easy! On the actual Swap, it will be $4,000-$5400 for the marriage swap to get installed in my region. I plan on buying GM direct when I do. Only $21,000 from them. If I go, aftermarket Vender may be slightly cheaper or may be more expensive. Seems like no one actually thought things though as I have so far, or knows how to conserve currency for a larger picture. I still have 2 years of planning I am giving myself.

Wow, you've made a lot of assumptions, but it sounds like you are convinced that you have all the answers and the conclusions. The folks here, who actually HAVE CTS-Vs and work on them, modify them and race them...these guys have got nothing on your research I guess. The CTS uses the same gear ratio so therefore you assert that the V uses the same differential. That, friend is ridiculous and uninformed.
I thought you would be asking "is the differential the same?" but no... you've just decided they are.

Good luck with the swap... But it's not really going to happen.

 

[MrSurly]

Tunning, I got that already covered. Monte GTR, own one currently.

Perhaps you meant "tuning"?
Wait, are you suggesting that to get a 1000HP....all ya gotta do is TUNE it?


Man, did I go wrong!

Look, I'd love to see you do the swap, take lots of pictures, I'd like to see the write up and the results.
But you are not serious.

 

[MeanMike]

2013 3.6L Subframe, I am not sure about that. The Rear Differential is the same as with the V, 373 Final Drive. FE2 style Struts/ Shocks installed, Sport Shock Absorbers (AC Delco FE2). I had them replaced during the winter of 2021-2022. It is a Premium Collection Submodel above Performance 2nd in line of the list with the V at the top. On the Brakes Calipers, I can get a set of new OEM, all 4 for the Camaro, at AutoZone for around $400 and put them on myself, Brakes are easy! On the actual Swap, it will be $4,000-$5400 for the marriage swap to get installed in my region. I plan on buying GM direct when I do. Only $21,000 from them. If I go, aftermarket Vender may be slightly cheaper or may be more expensive. Seems like no one actually thought things though as I have so far, or knows how to conserve currency for a larger picture. I still have 2 years of planning I am giving myself.

Damn, you have this all figured out. Please start the build thread ASAP.

Here's the link to send me the PM for the half price part out. Cadillac CTS-V Forum If you could, please save the crate for the LS9.